Thanks to both Rick and Rob for the above to pieces of gold knuggety goodness...


Just swung by the bearing shop again and bid good morning to Sydneys grumpiest old men, where I ever so gratefully received my 2nd free 19x1.5 circlip. Hooray for local bearing shops.

As I arrived back at home I am greeted by an enormous box from motobins, sweet times indeed.

yippee !

Well, good news! I found the infamous "SAFE PLACE"!!!

And my important things are still there!!!

Its just, yesterday the postie delivered the brand new ones Id bought to replace the ones lost to the safe place!!

If anybody needs:

K1100 fork seals
K1100 fork gaitors
Oil/water pump kit
steering head bearings

Let me know!

Plenty of 1100 owners in here floyd so stick em in a safe place till they contact you. 

robmack wrote:

... then on go the cleaned up K1100 throttle bodies and injectors (cleaned my the local brake mechanic in his ultrasonic cleaner) into the brand spanking new throttle body manifold rubbers

Floyd,   Have you a plan for fitting the TPS on the new throttle bodies?  If not, consider swapping the butterfly shaft in TB4 with an old one from one of the K100 throttle bodies.  Fitting the TPS will be a breeze afterwards.

Thanks heaps for that info and link robmack. Great stuff - will surely help me in the very near future

Very good few days really....managed to get the following done....


Got the gearbox all back together and it appears to be functioning ok.
Was a rainy day so the proceedings were forced to move in doors - luckily this conicided with the significant other and the flat mate both being away.,...



Changing gears can be a bit of a shit sometimes but I reckon when there is a bit of a load on the output shaft it should be rather nice. Hopefully I got the bearing preload and end float measurements and shim adjustments correct...time shall tell...




Today, the focus was on fitting the K1100 throttle bodies....

Thanks to an above post/link  from robmack, I was able to quickly and easily fit the K100 throttle position sensor to the K1100 TBs. This is done by swapping the butterfly shaft of the 4th throttle body from the 100 into the 1100. Easy.

K1100 TBs with K100 TPS - direct bolt on...



Here we have the K100 TBS on the K1100 TB's - also showing the fully renewed and cleaned K1100 injectors on the K100RS injector rail 

EDIT: Thanks to RickG for the heads up, I have heaps of 46mm BMW clamps on hand to replace the dis possible 1 use jobbies. 


I mounted them up into their brand new manifold rubbers (which I had fitted previously after cleaning up the mating surfaces etc etc) and quickly discovered and clearance issue with the throttle cable arm thingy that moves when the throttle is opened.

My solution to this may or may not be the correct one....

I had to remove TB #3 from each TB 'rack' and swap their respective throttle-arm-thingy-that-rotates-when-throttle-is-opened, and all other associated K100 throttle cable/FPR mounting hardware....This has solved the clearance issues obviously, however I think the 'balance' of the butterfly valves was thrown out in the process and I have played around with their adjustment screws to a point where they are all mostly sealed when throttle is closed. It seems I have run out of room on the adjustment screws....hmmm....




And here is where we are so far, as far as the assembly is concerned....






On top of all this, I took a bottle of nice red wine from Orange NSW to my new mate the brake mechanic at Marrickville - now he lets me use the press my self so I decided to press the steering stem out enough to remove the lower bearing. HOLY SHIT does that thing require some force to move! But, got it off I did...

For future reference I drive a thin knife blade under the bearing then progressively wider blades then a lever like a screwdriver and the bearing usually comes off. If that doesn't work weld a great big glob of metal onto the bearing inner and belt the crap out of it and the inner expands and flop off it comes.
Those shafts are usually shrunk in liquid nitrogen to get them into the triple clamp so its no wonder it was a touch reluctant.

RicK G wrote:For future reference I drive a thin knife blade under the bearing then progressively wider blades then a lever like a screwdriver and the bearing usually comes off. If that doesn't work weld a great big glob of metal onto the bearing inner and belt the crap out of it and the inner expands and flop off it comes.
Those shafts are usually shrunk in liquid nitrogen to get them into the triple clamp so its no wonder it was a touch reluctant.

Wow, should have asked first.

I think it twas the Haynes manual that recommended the method I adopted. Any chance of doing it damage this way?


On the topic of steering stems...

This is on the K1100 stem - as it was when I bought it....Any thoughts?

I wouldn't think you would do any damage to it and as for the gouge don't even worry about it that part of the stem would have very little stress and welding it would probably cause more harm than good.
It looks to me the sort of damage you would get from a forced steering lock but the lock on a K1100 is external at the top.
One more mystery that probably never be solved.

Ok, calling all experts....


Ive opened pandoras box and messed with things I should never have messed with and now lifes as we know it as in grave danger - you know how it goes...


Ive messed with ever possible thing that should not be messed with on the throttle bodies. I know, I know, you can sigh, moan, grumble and roll your eyes at the young newby all you like.....but NOw I have a good set of messed up throttle bodies and I NEED HELP

How do I proceed? Is a motorcycle mechanic able to get them back into any kind of resemblance of balanced? Specifically, the little 8mm locknut and screw that is marked with paint and clearly should not be messed with. The balance of the throttle butterfly bits is all out of wack....I can get 3 out the four all closed up evenly, but the 4th stays open a little... should they all be totally closed, or just equal to each other?

I know they were done on a flow bench by nuclear physicists etc, but surely all hope is not lost....

Hmmm I did wonder about that.
They should all close completely. I'm not sure they use a flow bench but a jig for sure.
I found that the PO's idiot dealer mechanic had messed with mine (don't tell anyone else but it was Motohansa) and had to get them right again. They still aren't quite right and the idle is too high.
I held the butterflys open by the idle adj screw and got the one that opened with the throttle cable (#3 I think) to a point where the reverse end of a 1/16 drill bit just fitted then worked on the other 3 to get them to match.
I know that if you close the adjuster up too tight you get all sorts of problems.
I got them to the stage where they are good enough to work well but not spot on because I cant get the vacuum gauges to read evenly.
There was a write up done here on the subject but as usual I can't find it. It may have been mike p that did it.
I now have a second set that are untouched so will be using them and putting 3/4 of this set on the K75.

Thanks Rick.....

Bloody dickhead I am - was to impatient and rushed into it - you know how it is sometimes....

Anyways, I will play with them, but considering I could pick up another set for 100 or less, I may opt to take that option...shame to 'destroy' something though  especially through a bad choice rather than use.

Wonder if they are worth anything to anyone? In all fairness though, if its soooo important that they aren't messed with, they could have devised a better way of permanently locking them in place....

It took me a full day of fiddling to get mine to where they are now.
Keep them they will be worth something to someone when we find the shafts are starting to wear in 2043.

RicK G wrote:Keep them they will be worth something to someone when we find the shafts are starting to wear in 2043.

 

floyd wrote:

RicK G wrote:For future reference I drive a thin knife blade under the bearing then progressively wider blades then a lever like a screwdriver and the bearing usually comes off. If that doesn't work weld a great big glob of metal onto the bearing inner and belt the crap out of it and the inner expands and flop off it comes.
Those shafts are usually shrunk in liquid nitrogen to get them into the triple clamp so its no wonder it was a touch reluctant.

Wow, should have asked first.

I think it twas the Haynes manual that recommended the method I adopted. Any chance of doing it damage this way?


On the topic of steering stems...

This is on the K1100 stem - as it was when I bought it....Any thoughts?

hmmm to long a bolt on the fairing tree that mounts to the steering stem ? 
I wouldn't worry about it

floyd wrote:Ok, calling all experts....

Ive opened pandoras box and messed with things I should never have messed with and now lifes as we know it as in grave danger - you know how it goes...

Yeah, I was skeptical when I read what you had done.  Anyway, this thread has a PDF that may help you get those throttle bodies back into shape.

Also, read through this thread

/robmack wrote:

floyd wrote:Ok, calling all experts....

Ive opened pandoras box and messed with things I should never have messed with and now lifes as we know it as in grave danger - you know how it goes...

Yeah, I was skeptical when I read what you had done.  Anyway, this thread has a PDF that may help you get those throttle bodies back into shape.

Also, read through this thread

Have you got the PDF mate? I cant find it on that first thread link

Robmac's second use of the phrase "this thread" is a gooden read it and follow it, mostly though if you have no intention of reshimming the valves any time soon then set your butterfly's anyway, then go set the bypass screws at the engines present state of tune, you will get the best sync for now, when you reshim or replace the rubber then redo the butterflies and the bypass screws after that and it will be at its best for then.

floyd wrote:Have you got the PDF mate? I cant find it on that first thread link

You'll see the link hidden in the second post to that thread, at the bottom of the posting. It's not readily apparent at first glance.

robmack wrote:

floyd wrote:Have you got the PDF mate? I cant find it on that first thread link

You'll see the link hidden in the second post to that thread, at the bottom of the posting.  It's not readily apparent at first glance.

Can see the post in question....but no link...hmmm

robmack wrote:

floyd wrote:Have you got the PDF mate? I cant find it on that first thread link

You'll see the link hidden in the second post to that thread, at the bottom of the posting.  It's not readily apparent at first glance.

Rob you need to be logged in to get the link

Ah, my computer logs in automatically for me so I'm oblivious to the need.  Sorry.

Well, after a day spent away from 'Bob Marley and the Wailers' - and spent reading various things about throttle bodies, Ive decided Ill continue with what I have.

I will have to balance the butterflies as much as possible, mount up the TBs as usual and do a fair bit of fiddling once its all together and running to see if it can be synced well enough. If not, well Ebay here I come....

At least its a fairly cheap mistake, I just hate the waste though....

Anyways, whats the worst that can happen?

Poor runner, hard to start, vibes?

floyd wrote:Anyways, whats the worst that can happen?

Detonation,,,,,,,blowback explosion..............and nuclear mayhem   :cherry: .

Inge K. wrote:

floyd wrote:Anyways, whats the worst that can happen?

Detonation,,,,,,,blowback explosion..............and nuclear mayhem   :cherry: .

Ooooooooh, Singularity - here we come!   

      You would get all three that you mention.....in the opposite direction, depending of how far out from the balance point you are.......and a higher fuel consumption.

Happy Easter Gents      



Ok, on to business....Are these good enough to use again?

Although not the only measure of a good friction plate, what's the thickness of the material?  Spec says :
Total thickness of clutch plate (with lining) = 5.3mm ± 0.25
Min. thickness of clutch plate = 4.5mm


Yours doesn't look fouled by oil in any case.

robmack wrote:Although not the only measure of a good friction plate, what's the thickness of the material?  Spec says :
Total thickness of clutch plate (with lining) = 5.3mm ± 0.25
Min. thickness of clutch plate = 4.5mm


Yours doesn't look fouled by oil in any case.

Unless Im mistaken, these are the 'pressure plate' and 'housing cover'.

I have a brand new friction plate to go in, just wondering about the little tiny bits of pitting and marking etc, or if this doesnt really matter.

I believe it was the original 220,000km - 30 year old friction plate in there, which was trashed by oil and was general rooted, but it wasnt worn right down to the point of the rivets scoring.

There are marks left by what looks like the rivets, probably while it was left sitting and those rivets corroded away and left a corrosion mark on the plate they were touching....?

Clymers lists the friction plate spec as 5.05mm - 5.55mm, minimum thickness 4.5mm.  This jives with the BMW spec I referenced.

If I had a brand new friction plate (or clutch assembly) and it was my bike, I'd not even think about the old one.  I'd just replace it as a matter of course.

yeah yeah yeah totally with you mate. I have a brand spanking new friction plate here to go in. The old one is in the bin. My questions has absolutely nothing to do with the friction plate.

I want to know about the acceptable wear on the items in the pictures - the pressure plate and the plate housing. Im already to put everything back together, including a new friction plate. Just need confirmation on the other items, as they were not as sparkly new as I was hoping

The surfaces look OK to me. not by any means perfect but acceptable. Make sure they are flat i.e. not dished so that a new friction plate will only bite at the edge. When I put a new friction plate in my K1100 the steel plates were dished so bad that I had about 1/8" effective area at the outer edge and guess what, the thing would slip at any more than a slight twist of the wrist.
I did however put a pair of dished steel plates back into a K75 recently because the friction plate was worn to match and had heaps of meat left. That was 12 months and 20,000km ago and its still fine. I would expect another 60-80,000 from it.

RicK G wrote:The surfaces look OK to me. not by any means perfect but acceptable. Make sure they are flat i.e. not dished so that a new friction plate will only bite at the edge. When I put a new friction plate in my K1100 the steel plates were dished so bad that I had about 1/8" effective area at the outer edge and guess what, the thing would slip at any more than a slight twist of the wrist.
I did however put a pair of dished steel plates back into a K75 recently because the friction plate was worn to match and had heaps of meat left. That was 12 months and 20,000km ago and its still fine. I would expect another 60-80,000 from it.

There is a slight sharp lip at the inner and outer edges. only a few mm wide and maybe <1mm raised... would a bit of wet and dry on a flat block be advisable or a no no?

That is most likely where the friction plate does not touch. check the new plate does not touch there either and all should be OK.
You should be able to check with the depth measurement on some verniers the depth of the lip but I doubt it would be near 1mm but if it is on both then the spring gets a bit weak as it does with a worn friction plate. If it is a mm or more replace them.

Ok, sweet.

Got the clutch in, gearbox on and mock mounted the frame. Goota figure out where all the spacers go for the engine mounts etc....

Thanks to Waz for the loan of a torque wrench big enough to do up the clutch nut.

Got he clutch all lined up using a permanent marker I found in the tool chest, and by putting the GB on and off a few times

YAY!   

Looking good Floyd,
I might have to pay you a visit and borrow Wazzaz torque wrench.

Hey Waz, can I borrow your torque wrench?

Are you putting the fairing back on?

too lazy to go back through the last 97 pages to find out.
Just an fyi, there is a piece of rubber goes over the air box to help deflect the heat.
Put it back on when you put the frame on (if that is the way you are going)
Part number 6

Ahhh yeah thanks for that Rossko. Almost forgot.

Will be putting the RS front fairing back on, with the exception of the side/battery covers, and thats it at this stage.

So you are coming to Nindigully then 
Have you got side covers?

Yeah looking good Floyd, I think you'll need a confined spaces ticket soon, as your work space isn't getting any bigger.

The bike is surrely starting to look like a bike again , about that. Rubber thing , is its purpose to lead the air out the side vents instead of under the sidecovers ? And does it work (sorry to crash the trhead floyd)

K-rider

RicK G wrote:So you are coming to Nindigully then 
Have you got side covers?

hehehe maybe maybe...

I should have a few sets of side covers. We'll wait and see if there is a pair without broken poking bits.

k-rider wrote:The bike is surrely starting to look like a bike again , about that. Rubber thing , is its purpose to lead the air out the side vents instead of under the sidecovers ? And does it work (sorry to crash the trhead floyd)

K-rider

It is supposed to do that and well it sort of works. The heat coming back on the riders legs is a continuing source of complaint.

Hey Waz, can I borrow your torque wrench?

Yes mate.

rossko wrote:
there is a piece of rubber goes over the air box to help deflect the heat.
Put it back on when you put the frame on (if that is the way you are going)
Part number 6

Can you get (6) in with the frame on, or it must be put in before the frame?

A bit of stiff wire to skewer the rubber and some soapy water and drag it through.

If you need to repair the side covers or any other plastic this stuff is good gear http://www.threewayworks.com.au/plastex-2

Ok there is alot of conflicting information on this topic, and Im a fool and didnt pay attention when I was dismantling....


When putting the frame back on a 1984 K100 RS, do you:

A) only shim the front left mount

B) shim all mounts if necessary 


?????

I'm assuming that your 84 has a bridge tank mount and not the plug tank mounts.  It could be either way (A or B) depending on how tightening screws 1, 2 and 3 reveal gaps at 4 and 5.

This screen shot comes from the BMW manual, page 11-97.0.

Yeah Ive got that one mate and have seen it, cheers. 
I think Haynes says something slightly different, like if there is any gap at any mount, its better to shim it then just pull it in with the bolts. This conflict has me seeking advise

I have gaps at all mounting points...including 1,2 and 3 in that pic....

Do I follow the BMW manual, or shim each mount....hmmm...will go and play around a bit more...

RicK G wrote:If you need to repair the side covers or any other plastic this stuff is good gear http://www.threewayworks.com.au/plastex-2

I have both side covers and a major fairing mount fixed with good old 2 part araldite. They have both held for the 18 years I have had the bike.