BMW K bikes (Bricks)


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1Back to top Go down   Overfuelling badly Empty Overfuelling badly Fri Jul 28, 2023 5:03 pm

Dai

Dai
Life time member
Life time member
Yah well. I replaced the FPR as detailed in another thread and made sure that fuel pressure is now BMW's beloved 2.5 bar. Engine runs like a bag of rusty Irish nails and stalls below 2000 (!!) rpm. Petrol is urinating out of the exhaust/silencer joint. All four cylinders are firing. What I've done:

- Checked the thermostat (seemed to react okay when subjected to the various warm water temperatures) and then replaced it with one I knew was good
- Changed the temperature sensor relay
- Wiring loom is all good (I made it, but it doesn't mean that it was perfect from the start. It wasn't - but that's another story. At the time the bike ran reasonably well with just enough wiring harness to fire it up, so I completed the job)
- Injectors are putting out a good spray pattern. I cleaned them through with carb cleaner anyway
- Spark plugs are new with the correct gap, but I get the same problem with the old ones
- Crankcase breather has been replaced because it was showing signs of starting to split
- All other intake rubbers are okay - no signs of any splitting or perishing. They were replaced about ten years ago with spanky new ones secured with worm drives, so it's easy to get a look at them
- Disconnected the fuel pump while running and as the fuel runs out, the engine starts purring beautifully (as expected given the problem)
- Fuel filter has been replaced and inserted the right way round (this time)...
- Air filter is good and properly seated
- Swapped out both the ICU and FICU with no change in behaviour
- Also swapped out the airbox and MAF

LFB ran nicely for about fifteen miles on the way to the annual MoT test and then threw a sulk before I got there. Since then it's been over-fuelling like crazy; somefink somewear is telling it that the engine is cold. Anyone any ideas....?


__________________________________________________
1983 K100 naked upgraded to K100LT spec after spending time as an RS and an RT
1987 K100RT
Others...
1978 Moto Guzzi 850-T3, 1979 Moto Guzzi 850-T3 California,1993 Moto Guzzi 1100ie California
2020 Royal Enfield Bullet 500
    

2Back to top Go down   Overfuelling badly Empty Re: Overfuelling badly Fri Jul 28, 2023 5:23 pm

jbt

jbt
Life time member
Life time member
Did you change the temp sensor itself?


__________________________________________________
Let us enjoy the transient delight
That fills our fairest day.
    

3Back to top Go down   Overfuelling badly Empty Re: Overfuelling badly Fri Jul 28, 2023 5:27 pm

Dai

Dai
Life time member
Life time member
Yes. No.1 on the list above.

Edit: guess it's not beyond the realms of possibility that the replacement isn't behaving. I'll do the heat test on that tomorrow. It's a good job that the radiator is only filled with plain water for now!



Last edited by Dai on Fri Jul 28, 2023 5:30 pm; edited 1 time in total


__________________________________________________
1983 K100 naked upgraded to K100LT spec after spending time as an RS and an RT
1987 K100RT
Others...
1978 Moto Guzzi 850-T3, 1979 Moto Guzzi 850-T3 California,1993 Moto Guzzi 1100ie California
2020 Royal Enfield Bullet 500
    

4Back to top Go down   Overfuelling badly Empty Re: Overfuelling badly Fri Jul 28, 2023 5:27 pm

jbt

jbt
Life time member
Life time member
N° 2 is the temp sensor relay, not the temp sensor.


__________________________________________________
Let us enjoy the transient delight
That fills our fairest day.
    

5Back to top Go down   Overfuelling badly Empty Re: Overfuelling badly Fri Jul 28, 2023 5:31 pm

Dai

Dai
Life time member
Life time member
Edited. You were quick! Very Happy

    

6Back to top Go down   Overfuelling badly Empty Re: Overfuelling badly Fri Jul 28, 2023 5:49 pm

Laitch

Laitch
Life time member
Life time member
Maybe the return line is defective and kinked, or collapsing internally and raising fuel pressure at the rail.


__________________________________________________
1995 K75 90,000 miles
    

7Back to top Go down   Overfuelling badly Empty Re: Overfuelling badly Fri Jul 28, 2023 5:52 pm

Point-Seven-five

Point-Seven-five
Life time member
Life time member
Are the injectors pulsing or are they open all the time? 

If the fuel pressure regulator is adjustable, what happens if you reduce the pressure to where the engine runs well?


__________________________________________________
Present: 1991 K100RS "Moby Brick Too"
 
Past:
1994 K75RT "Ilsa, She Wolf of the SS"
1988 K100RS SE "Special Ed"
1994 K75S "Cheetos"
1992 K100RS "Moby Brick" R.I.P.
1982 Honda FT500
1979 Honda XR185
1977 Honda XL125
1974 Honda XL125
1972 OSSA Pioneer 250
1968 Kawasaki 175
    

8Back to top Go down   Overfuelling badly Empty Re: Overfuelling badly Fri Jul 28, 2023 6:11 pm

duck

duck
Life time member
Life time member
My K100 did that - gas flowing out of exhaust.

Problem: A previous owner or tech had put the temp sensor back on the pipe coming out of the head BUT they forgot the wire clip so the temp sensor eventually fell off. Seeing infinite resistance, the L-Jet thought that  the engine was at 0 degrees Kelvin and fed as much fuel as it could.


__________________________________________________
Current stable:
86 Custom K100 (standard fairing, K75 Belly pan, Ceramic chromed engine covers, paralever)
K75 Frankenbrick (Paralever, K11 front end, hybrid ABS, K1100RS fairing, radial tires)
86 K75C Turbo w/ paralever
94 K1100RS
93 K1100LT
91 K1
93 K75S (K11 front end)
91 K75S (K1 front end)
14 Yamaha WR250R
98 Taxi Cab K1200RS
14 K1600GT
http://www.ClassicKBikes.com
    

9Back to top Go down   Overfuelling badly Empty Re: Overfuelling badly Fri Jul 28, 2023 6:18 pm

Dai

Dai
Life time member
Life time member
@Laitch: New lines all through and flowing in nice curves (oo - err!)
@Point-Seven-five: the engine used to run well (and did for a short while) so it's a 'new' fault and I don't want to mess with the FPR in case the fault decides to disappear at a most inconvenient time (but I will check the injectors tomorrow. They rattle like buggery when subjected to 50Hz (approx 3000rpm) but another check won't go amiss)
@duck: that clip is definately on there and the connector is welll secured


__________________________________________________
1983 K100 naked upgraded to K100LT spec after spending time as an RS and an RT
1987 K100RT
Others...
1978 Moto Guzzi 850-T3, 1979 Moto Guzzi 850-T3 California,1993 Moto Guzzi 1100ie California
2020 Royal Enfield Bullet 500
    

10Back to top Go down   Overfuelling badly Empty Re: Overfuelling badly Fri Jul 28, 2023 7:12 pm

duck

duck
Life time member
Life time member
Can't hurt and is easy to check the temp sensor resistance at L-Jet pin 10.


__________________________________________________
Current stable:
86 Custom K100 (standard fairing, K75 Belly pan, Ceramic chromed engine covers, paralever)
K75 Frankenbrick (Paralever, K11 front end, hybrid ABS, K1100RS fairing, radial tires)
86 K75C Turbo w/ paralever
94 K1100RS
93 K1100LT
91 K1
93 K75S (K11 front end)
91 K75S (K1 front end)
14 Yamaha WR250R
98 Taxi Cab K1200RS
14 K1600GT
http://www.ClassicKBikes.com
    

11Back to top Go down   Overfuelling badly Empty Re: Overfuelling badly Sat Jul 29, 2023 3:38 pm

Dai

Dai
Life time member
Life time member
Well, the fnbtch has fixed itself. I started off with the same problems as yesterday, then

- rechecked the temperature sensor
- put an older one back in
- no change in engine behaviour
- checked the wiring as per Duck's suggestion - all perfect
- switched the FICU for the one off Kostenlot - no change in behaviour again
- pulled the injectors and grinned as the cylinders launched fireworks in 4-2-3-1 order
- injectors were visibly pulsing and the pattern on the floor was nice and circular for each one
- reinserted the injectors and reconnected all hoses
- thumbed the start button to clear any remaining fuel in the hoses (hello? that sounded different)
- re-attached the tank and the damn thing immediately settled into a steady idle
I HATE IT WHEN A PROBLEM LIKE THAT FIXES ITSELF Overfuelling badly 259495 

So what did I do that I hadn't done before? Checked the injectors. That's it; I haven't got a clue how that could fix an over-fuelling problem.


__________________________________________________
1983 K100 naked upgraded to K100LT spec after spending time as an RS and an RT
1987 K100RT
Others...
1978 Moto Guzzi 850-T3, 1979 Moto Guzzi 850-T3 California,1993 Moto Guzzi 1100ie California
2020 Royal Enfield Bullet 500
    

12Back to top Go down   Overfuelling badly Empty Re: Overfuelling badly Sun Jul 30, 2023 11:34 am

Suzi Q

Suzi Q
Life time member
Life time member
Pat the sleeping dog on the head.....gently.
And walk away.


__________________________________________________
Sometimes I'm not really Suzi Quatro.
    

13Back to top Go down   Overfuelling badly Empty Re: Overfuelling badly Sun Jul 30, 2023 11:39 am

Suzi Q

Suzi Q
Life time member
Life time member
"pulled the injectors and grinned as the cylinders launched fireworks in 4-2-3-1 order"

Your crank's broken.  Shocked


(Or are you just checking we're paying attention?)


__________________________________________________
Sometimes I'm not really Suzi Quatro.
    

14Back to top Go down   Overfuelling badly Empty Re: Overfuelling badly Sun Jul 30, 2023 12:16 pm

92KK 84WW Olaf

avatar
Life time member
Life time member
Where did the temperature sensor come from? 

I have a similar issue on my RS and I am very curious as to cause. I know all the kit is good, changed temp sensor at one point [got a few brand new ones] and am a little suspicious of them. clips etc all good.


__________________________________________________
1992 K100LT 0193214 Bertha Blue 101,000 miles
1984 K100RT 0022575 Brutus Baja Red 578 bought 36,000 now 89,150 miles
1997 K1100LT 0188024 Wotan Mystic Red 689 58,645 now 106,950 miles Deceased.
1983 K100RS 0011157 Fricka 606 Alaska Blue 29,495 miles Damn K Pox Its a Bat outta Hell Now 58,200 miles. 
1996 K1100LT 0233004 Lohengrin Mystic Red 38,000 miles currently 51,800 miles.
1983 K100RS 0004449 Odette R100 colours 58,000 miles. Sprint fairing now 63,390 miles

Past:
1968 Yamaha 80 YG1
1971 Yamaha 125 YAS-1
1968 Honda 125 SS
1970 Honda CD 175
1973 Honda CB500-4
Honda CX 500
    

15Back to top Go down   Overfuelling badly Empty Re: Overfuelling badly Sun Jul 30, 2023 5:16 pm

Dai

Dai
Life time member
Life time member
Olaf: The sensor that's now in there used to be in LFB, then got replaced because a while back I thought it might be buggered, then was put back in there yesterday.

Chris: Well that was the order the fireworks went off in! Very Happy


__________________________________________________
1983 K100 naked upgraded to K100LT spec after spending time as an RS and an RT
1987 K100RT
Others...
1978 Moto Guzzi 850-T3, 1979 Moto Guzzi 850-T3 California,1993 Moto Guzzi 1100ie California
2020 Royal Enfield Bullet 500
    

16Back to top Go down   Overfuelling badly Empty Re: Overfuelling badly Sun Jul 30, 2023 8:40 pm

Rick G

Rick G
admin
admin
If you used the old copper washer under the temp sensor be warned copper oxide will only pass current in one direction. I remember charlie chasing a problem all around the woods and when he cleaned the washer or a new one (don't remember which) it came good.
You may have rectified the problem by changing the temp sensor.


__________________________________________________
"Man sacrifices his health in order to make money.
Then he sacrifices money to recuperate his health.
And then he is so anxious about the future that he does not enjoy the present; the result being that he does not live in the present or the future; he lives as if he is never going to die, and then dies having never really lived."   Dalai Lama


Bikes 1999 K1100 LT with a Big Block 1200
    

17Back to top Go down   Overfuelling badly Empty Re: Overfuelling badly Sun Jul 30, 2023 8:55 pm

Dai

Dai
Life time member
Life time member
Both the old washer and the new one were/are aluminium. I'm not sure that was the problem Rick, because after I'd changed it the engine behaviour was still the same (overfuelling and pretending to be a bag of Irish nails).


__________________________________________________
1983 K100 naked upgraded to K100LT spec after spending time as an RS and an RT
1987 K100RT
Others...
1978 Moto Guzzi 850-T3, 1979 Moto Guzzi 850-T3 California,1993 Moto Guzzi 1100ie California
2020 Royal Enfield Bullet 500
    

18Back to top Go down   Overfuelling badly Empty Re: Overfuelling badly Sun Jul 30, 2023 11:10 pm

Rick G

Rick G
admin
admin
That surely wasn't the cause and it's never a good feeling to know that the cause is likely to be lurking and waiting for your next ride.


__________________________________________________
"Man sacrifices his health in order to make money.
Then he sacrifices money to recuperate his health.
And then he is so anxious about the future that he does not enjoy the present; the result being that he does not live in the present or the future; he lives as if he is never going to die, and then dies having never really lived."   Dalai Lama


Bikes 1999 K1100 LT with a Big Block 1200
    

redrockmania

redrockmania
Silver member
Silver member
It's worth repeating several problems with Chinese sourced CTS's. Sellers offering these often list the sensor they are selling as suitable for both 2 valve and 4 valve engines - (Impossible and misleading). Carefully look at the year/model compatibility they claim. If you have a sensor you suspect may be incorrect, do the temperature testing to check it performs to specification. A problem I had with a new Chinese CTS I fitted (then replaced) was that it distorted when being fitted. It was not over tightening it - just poor quality brass/manufacturing quality control). In discussions with Charlie, he recommends carefully tinning the copper washer with solder to resist corrosion which is a common cause of CTS malfunction. If you have to reuse a copper washer and don't have a new one available, consider annealing it to soften the copper and help with sealing. Noting the comparatively high price of the 2 valve BMW CTS, there are equivalent European made CTS's available of good quality and at less cost. Many other motorcycles and cars have similar problems of the CTS failing or malfunctioning - the CTS is not the most reliable electrical component.

    

20Back to top Go down   Overfuelling badly Empty Re: Overfuelling badly Mon Jul 31, 2023 6:49 am

Dai

Dai
Life time member
Life time member
@redrockmania: Good points. Fortunately in my case I was dealing with one OEM ('Bosch' stamped on the side) and one from Malpassi with good old 'Made in Italy' stamped on it. It's the Bosch one that's in there now.

@Rick G: don't tell me... I might think about trusting it when I've put another thousand or so miles on it.


__________________________________________________
1983 K100 naked upgraded to K100LT spec after spending time as an RS and an RT
1987 K100RT
Others...
1978 Moto Guzzi 850-T3, 1979 Moto Guzzi 850-T3 California,1993 Moto Guzzi 1100ie California
2020 Royal Enfield Bullet 500
    

21Back to top Go down   Overfuelling badly Empty Re: Overfuelling badly Mon Jul 31, 2023 6:34 pm

Matthew-Brisbane

Matthew-Brisbane
Life time member
Life time member
another thing to 
Check is the wiring connector at the back left under the tank. 
Where the cable from the temp sensor joins the into the main loom and goes to the brain  

It was this connector that was giving Vic his problem as one of the wires had been ever so slightly pulled thus opening the connection within the connector block itself.  
any corrosion would also give the same result.


__________________________________________________
1986 K100 RS Motorsport
1988 K100 RS SE
1990 K1 known as Barn Find 
2004 F650 GS known as DACK-DACK
 
#### K100 RS Project 
2011 R1200 GS known as Big Blue 
    

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